These questions come from the old General Cicada Questions message board. The questions and answers are in reverse order. URLs found in comments are old and likely do not work.
Hi Jay- the bottle exuviae are similar to the “floury Baker” (Aleeta curvicosta) and I shall try to post a picture. Max Mould’s book “Australian cicadas” has a picture. My daughter was at Hawk’s Nest last week and caught a few smaller species. One was black and about 12mm long (with wings)and has a different song to similar species around sydney here.
To Vhem,
Around 18C is about the temp for green grocers (GGs) to sing at night. I have noticed recently that our local bottle cicadas will sing on evenings that are around 16C. If the temp is hot, GGs will sing around every 4 hours during the night. Those bugs ain’t so small- I guess it depends what species are out in numbers around your place!
David
Comment by David Emery — December 17, 2009 [AT] 10:17 pm
Hi there We live on the Central Coast of NSW and the cicada’s are out and going for it. Have noticed that alot of people mention how loud they are but maybe we are just use to it. My daughter spends her time searching for the spent cicada shells and now has quite a collection. While looking at these shells and listening to their song, my children and myself were discussing the why’s and how’s of cicada and my eldest mentioned that the cicada will only start to sing once the temperature has reached a certain degree, I agreed with him that I had once heard this too. We’ve tried some internet searching and have come up with no ansewer to our question.
So we now ask you budding cicada enthusiasts is this fact or myth. If it is fact what is the temperature that makes these cute little bugs sing for us all day.
ps: your site is great — we learnt alot about cicadas from your site.
cheers — vhem
(veronica, hayden, ethan, madison)
Comment by veronica — December 17, 2009 [AT] 5:34 pm
thanx David — I should have known there’ld be more than one “midget”. They are black, about one third your little finger in length. U probably know them well but if I can grab a pic, I will. Why is it I’ve not seen a Bottle casting? Would I know the diffrence if I saw one? Jay
Comment by Jay — December 16, 2009 [AT] 8:35 pm
Hi Jay,
Sydney bottles are isolated populations and there are certainly more on the central coast down to Avoca beach. What do you mean by “midget” as there are around 10 species from central coast? Would be useful to post a photo. The Blue mountains are heaving with the medium and smaller species as well at the moment, probably reflecting recent fires and recurrent showers.
David.
Comment by David E — December 9, 2009 [AT] 4:01 pm
g’day Cicada maniacs — how is it I didn’t even know about Bottle Cicadas, let alone see them, in all my years in Sydney. discovered them on the Central Coast, just 50ks north. And why are there some with both sets of wings and others with inner set only? The ones in my area have both.
It’s cicada Heaven here at the moment for green, black, midget and bottle. thanx, Jay
Comment by Jay — December 8, 2009 [AT] 2:12 am
Elias, I can get you some exuviae here if you like. Contact Dan for my email.
David.
Comment by David E — November 27, 2009 [AT] 8:33 pm
Chris, Definitely a Pauropsalta mneme- called the “alarm clock ticker” because of the shrill buzz. It has a huge range in NSW. They are emerging around Canberra now, along with about 6-8 other species.
David.
Comment by David E — November 27, 2009 [AT] 8:32 pm
Chris,
That looks like a Pauropsalta mneme.
Comment by Dan — November 24, 2009 [AT] 7:37 pm
Hi,
I managed to photograph a cicada at a site in the central tablelands on NSW Australia.last week, rather small about 35mm long. An image can be found at this link:
Hoping I can get an ID, seems to be hard to find references to cicadas on the net.
regards,
Chris Ross
Comment by Chris Ross — November 24, 2009 [AT] 6:24 pm
I am also very interested in exuvia (nymph shells). I was lucky to collect about 26 exuvia of Tibicen auletes, North America’s largest cicada. I have a specimen of Pomponia imperatoria as an adult. Really would like to get a nymphal exuvia. I checked the links Dan provided and couldn’t find any. Does anyone know where to find one?
Comment by Elias — November 21, 2009 [AT] 3:11 pm
In Center City Philadelphia, cicada singing is common in August. What species might this be?
Comment by Kenneth Frank — November 15, 2009 [AT] 7:06 pm
Can Cicadas loose a leg and survive?
I accidently hurt a cicada that I found when shaking the washing.
It is resting in a tree in shock as it had lost one leg from the knee, though has all other legs.
Hasn’t moved much all day, though walked up branch about 20 centremetres.
I havent ever seen one here and was not expecting to find one on washing. Will have to check dry clothes from now on.
xx ab
Comment by Alicia Bee — November 15, 2009 [AT] 4:13 am
Hi Dave J, Will see what I can do- there are quite a few GGs out now and we caught 2 Thopha (DDs) emerging yesterday around Kempsey on the north coast- first of the season so far.You had best contact Dan for my email and then I can get your postal address.
cheers,
David.
Comment by David E — November 9, 2009 [AT] 3:02 am
Hello David Emery in Sydney I assume. Could you send me some green grocer & or Double drummer shells. I need about 20 or so….will be glad to pay shipping. Was in Sydney once, Farmer’s Cove, burned the crap out of my thigh collecting some sort of palm seeds (red furry little rascals) that I had put in my pocket!
Cheers, Dave
Comment by Dave J — November 5, 2009 [AT] 2:27 pm
To Dave J- depends where in the world you are. Most of the shells in the tropics will be degraded by now. In Sydney, we have some green grocer shells (2 weeks old) that are around 5cm long. If you wait a month you can secure some Double drummer shells that are larger!!
Comment by David Emery — November 2, 2009 [AT] 9:50 pm
Cicadas of the genus Pomponia are the largest.
Comment by Dan — November 2, 2009 [AT] 8:31 pm
I need the largest cicada shells available for an art project. Where can I get them?
Comment by Dave J — November 2, 2009 [AT] 10:21 am
Hi Elias, Most emerge in the early evening to make the most of the bird-free zone. Some unfortunates (including me) run into some rather carnivorous tree crickets, huntsman (tarantula) spiders and nocturnal ants at night, but most emergences are uncomplicated. some cicadas get their times awry and maybe left coming out at sunrise.
We have several species that also emerge before dawn (Frogattoides pallida and F.typica in the desert) and if emergences are large, some like Thopha saccata (double drummer), Psaltoda plaga and Ps moerens (black prince and red-eye, respectively) and even small Urabunana verna, will emerge during the day- like your Magis! They’re all in Max’s book.
We have just had a week of wet weather with 75mm rain, so now things are heating up. I have noted 12 species out so far around Sydney.
Comment by David E — October 30, 2009 [AT] 5:04 pm
Hello David, Do you notice any different times for nymphs to come above ground? Do some species prefer times other than 8-10PM?
Thanks for your replies.
Elias
Comment by Elias — October 25, 2009 [AT] 6:38 pm
I know that problem! One solution I found is I have small containers with completely flat surfaces and nothing to climb on. I place one newly captured, non eclosing nymph into each container. As long as the nymph remains in the prone position, they usually do not eclose (I have seen some exceptions, especially with T. cannicularis for some reason). Got this tip from Gerry Bunker and it works most of the time. Maybe the Green Grocers act differently? I love Australian Cicadas. I have been through Max Mould’s book many times. Please keep us posted!!
Comment by Elias — October 24, 2009 [AT] 7:05 am
Yeah Elias, If you take them off the trees when emerging and don’t hook them (shells or exuviae) into a curtain or the inside of the “boot” (“trunk” to you in the USA) of the car, you will get loads of deformities as the larger ones can’t emerge correctly on their sides or backs. Nylon shirts are great to sink the claws into, but in the field, the boot of the car is great for transportation!!
Cheers,
David.
Comment by David E — October 21, 2009 [AT] 3:13 am
Awesome pictures, David. You found many Green Grocer nymphs that eclosed. Seems like many specimens were deformed by hemolymph. The cicadas of Australia are nice and big for the most part. We live vicariously through you. I wonder if its possible to post some videos of them calling. Hopefully this will be a fruitful summer for you. Here in NY, it’s is cold and rainy and the cicadas have been dead for over a month. Can’t complain however, I did manage to capture my first Tibicen auletes.
Comment by Elias — October 18, 2009 [AT] 6:28 am
Here’s some Green Grocers. Kevin’s photos.
Comment by Dan — October 13, 2009 [AT] 6:59 pm
Hi Dan, As you northerners rue the passing of summer and dream about next season, I will just let you know that the Green Grocer cicadas (Cyclochila australasiae) have commenced emerging in the mountains west of Sydney. The Sydney city emergence should start in a couple of weeks.
David.
Comment by David Emery — October 13, 2009 [AT] 6:34 pm
Quesada gigas song:
Cicada metamorfosis:
Text PDF about brazilian cicadas, with photos:
http://www.acervodigital.ufrrj.br/insetos/insetos_do_brasil/conteudo/tomo_03/02_cicadoida.pdf
Comment by wenilton luis daltro — October 9, 2009 [AT] 6:52 am
Do cicadas normally live in WESTERN Oregon? We heard one there this summer, and while I grew up in W. Oregon, I don’t believe they normally occur there, and had never heard of it before. I’ve been trying to figure it out from the internet stuff, but all I could find was that they DO occur in EASTERN Oregon, which is a much dryer climate (sage brush & juniper as opposed to ferns, moss, and big trees in the W.) I was just curious, because we’ve also seen praying mantis in western OR and WA in the last few years, and they were never native here, either. Please e-mail me at ciscoshirlbw [AT] yahoo.com
Thanks
Comment by Shirley — October 3, 2009 [AT] 3:00 pm
Wow, it is not even Spring yet for Australia and cicadas are out already! Hope this is a great season for you David. Bladder cicadas have a very interesting morphology.
Comment by Elias — September 18, 2009 [AT] 4:08 am
Bladder cicadas (Cystostoma saundersi) are out in Sydney Australia. The Aussie cicada season is open for business!
Comment by David Emery — September 16, 2009 [AT] 4:18 pm
It’s September 15 in Frederick Maryland and the cicadas have stopped singing 🙁 Last night they were talking up storm. They had so much to say. Today it is so quiet. It’s sad. Every year, one day in the middle of September, they just stop. Fall is coming. I do love Fall, but I will miss the cicadas’ song until next July.
Comment by Alison — September 15, 2009 [AT] 7:52 am
I would assume they were house fly or blue/green bottle fly larva. Cicada killers seal the cicadas in a cell and lay an egg on them. It is not possible to come upon a cicada kiler larva by chance alone above ground.
Comment by Elias — September 9, 2009 [AT] 3:29 am
We found a dead cicada on our porch. My daughter was checking it out when a maggot started coming out of it. We put the cicada in a plastic cup and 3 more maggots eventually came out of the cicada. I read some about the cicada killer wasps but this doesn’t seem like a cicada killer. Does anyone know what the maggots could be?
Comment by Valerie — September 8, 2009 [AT] 7:59 pm
Hi Jennifer: Elias is correct that the “blood” is cicada blood or haemolymph. We have moved hundreds of emerging cicadas from local tress onto our house curtains so my kids could watch and photograph emergence. During eclosion or emergence, cicadas pump this around to initially “force’ open the shell, probably with the help of a few proteases (that means the shells are “medicinal” and anti-febrile for traditional medicine!!) and pump the head and thorax through the split followed by legs. Then they hang to harden the legs before extracting the rest of the body (abdomen) and ahnging from the shell (exuviae)- fantastic to watch!! They then pump haemolymph into the patent wing veins to expand the wings- these veins collapse when the wings harden and dry in the breeze and sun. If there is a lesion or malfunction causing “bleeding”, there is usually a casuality in the emergence or in wing expansion, making them as easy target for predators.
Comment by David Emery — September 1, 2009 [AT] 7:21 pm
Rachelle, I, too, live in NY. We have cicadas here and no need to report them! If you wish to send me the specimen I can identify it for you. i live in Queens County.
Jennifer, I have seen this phenomenon too. When there is less undergrowth, cicadas compete for sites to eclose. They can injury each other with their sharp forelegs or be injured by ants and spiders looking to feed on them. Also during the eclose process injuries can occur. The bluish jelly like material is “hemolymph”i.e. cicada blood ,and turns black when exposed to the air. When they “bleed” alot, they usually fail to eclose. I hope this helps.
Comment by Elias — September 1, 2009 [AT] 2:59 pm
thanks Dan — presumably therefore, it only takes one to start and within a second, they’re all at it. How it is that they all end at the same time remains a mystery. I’ll be listening more intently this summer.
Comment by Jay — September 1, 2009 [AT] 3:41 am
I’ve been “helping” our regular, 2 year cicadas for years when they come out of the ground and I’ve seen all kinds of conditions and problems. One problem really “bugs” me (pun intended). I come across a few each year that seem to have some sort of bleeding disorder. They rarely make it off the ground. The “blood” pools behind the shell and I can see the black through the shell and even seeping out through the shell. They have no sign of injury. They just keep bleeding from all over. Every now and then I will find one that has “eclosed” (borrowing a term from butterflies), but the adult ends up bleeding all over the tree and doesn’t survive. Has anyone else seen this and has anyone come across any research that describes something like this, assuming there is research about the physical workings of cicadas?
Comment by Jennifer — August 30, 2009 [AT] 8:19 pm
Help! It’s 8.31.09, I’m in Brooklyn, NY and found one just like the blue/green one Dan has posted. I dont know how this poor thing came in, the screens are closed, he’s so big he scared the cats flittering and skittering himself all around and landed in a water filled soup pot that was soaking in sink. He’s deceased, but should I let anyone ‘official’ know? I never saw anything like this…in NY
Comment by Rachelle — August 30, 2009 [AT] 7:31 pm
Hello Jeff. The species of cicada is called Tibicen pruinosa. Here is a link to show what it looks like: http://www.musicofnature.com/songsofinsects/iframes/cicadas/popup_tibiprui.html
You are in a flat area that gets lots of sun and cicada killers will frequently make large mounds of dirt. See if you see the large female wasp entering and leaving the burrow. Sometimes she will bring paralyzed cicadas right in. This is the most comprehensive site on cicada killers I know of: http://ww2.lafayette.edu/~hollidac/cicadakillerhome.html
Other wasps also make burrows, but cicada killers make the largest.
Nice video — tell us what you find!
Comment by Elias — August 30, 2009 [AT] 5:47 am
are these cicada mounds I dont know
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gbHL-POMTc0
Comment by jeff edwards — August 29, 2009 [AT] 8:24 pm
Jay,
All the males (the ones that sing) are competing for mates, so if one starts to sing the others don’t want to be left out, so they all start to sing.
Comment by Dan — August 28, 2009 [AT] 5:21 am
g’day fellow cicada people. I know sfa about cicadas — I just love em. Here’s a stupid question — how is it that dozens or hundreds begin and end their ‘singing’ at the same time?
let me know if the answer is already here somewhere. thanx, Jay
Comment by Jay — August 28, 2009 [AT] 4:50 am
Wow — this is still technically winter for Australia. That is awesome. Here in NY we have to wait at least 3 months after the end of winter. Hope this is a good season for “down under”.
Comment by Elias — August 21, 2009 [AT] 3:25 pm
Hi All, After quite a warm winter, I am pleased to report the first song of a Cicadetta celis (“silver princess”) in the melaleucas around Sydney- roll on the southern hemisphere cicada season.
David.
Comment by David Emery — August 20, 2009 [AT] 9:51 pm
Does anyone in New York, New Jersey or Connecticut have any experience with hearing or finding Tibicen auletes? Here is a picture and call of this species for reference: http://www.musicofnature.com/songsofinsects/iframes/cicadas/popup_tibiaule.html
Comment by Elias — August 19, 2009 [AT] 5:27 pm
The observation of the loudness of cicadas with regard to temeprature has been studied. “Body Temeprature and the Acoustic Behavior of the Cicada Tibicen Winemanna” by Allen Sanboern published in the Journal of Insect Behavior
Comment by Elias — July 21, 2009 [AT] 10:14 am
Why do cicadas sound louder when its hot?
Comment by raevans — July 15, 2009 [AT] 11:45 am
to CeeCee, Cicada songsa mean “summer” down under!
Comment by David E — July 11, 2009 [AT] 4:16 am
old wives tale says noise of cicadas signify something. Fogs, rain etc. what is it?
Comment by CeeCee — July 8, 2009 [AT] 9:27 am
Hello Dan,
Heard back from Max Moulds who was kind enough to reply to my email. The good news is a second edition of Australain Cicadas will be produced which will have a considerably expanded introductory chapter and an additional 100 species.
The bad news is we will have to wait at least 5 years!!
So here is our answer. Like anything with cicadas, we need patience. At least it’s not 17 years!!
Comment by Elias — July 5, 2009 [AT] 5:54 am
Hi Dan, Max Moulds now lives in Kurandah near Cairns- he will be publishing a monograph on revised taxonomy of Australian Cicadettini soon, but don’t expect another edition of the book in the near future.
to Saeed; join the Yahoo Entomology-Cicadidae chat group and ask Fariba- she is a cicadaphile from Iran and works at the museum on plant pathogens
Comment by David E — July 5, 2009 [AT] 4:54 am
I am a Ph.D Student of Agricultural Entomology in University of Tehran, IRAN. I have caught some cicadas and cooked them by use of water-salt solution. Its taste is good, but i like to learn more recipes. Is there any person to help me?
Comment by Saeed Heidari — July 4, 2009 [AT] 8:53 am
Hello Dan,
The given email stated Dr. Moulds is no longer at that address. It then gives you another address to write too. I have asked our question and will patiently await a reply. I will keep you posted.
Take care,
Elias
Comment by Elias — July 2, 2009 [AT] 7:04 pm
Elias,
Let me know what you find out about the book.
Dan
Comment by Dan — June 30, 2009 [AT] 9:07 pm
Hello Dan,
Thank you very much! i have sent an email to Dr Moulds and I will keep you apprised as to its outcome.
Just got back from Las Vegas where I caught two Diceroprocta specimens just a block from the Las Vegas strip! They are currently alive in my little butterfly pavillion. I will see if they can call today.
Have a good day,
Elias
Comment by Elias — June 30, 2009 [AT] 8:01 am
Elias, have your tried contacting Max?
http://australianmuseum.net.au/staff/max-moulds/
Comment by Dan — June 24, 2009 [AT] 9:08 pm
Does anyone know if Max Moulds will write an updated edition? I have that book and it is excellent.
Comment by Elias — June 23, 2009 [AT] 3:09 pm
Hi Denis (April 6)- I think that Germany may be too far north for many cicadas. Try south of the Alps.
To Sonja (April 29)- Yeah, I live on the south coast in Oz and remember the seasons: especially the sand fairies (Cicadetta arenaria)landing on your towel at the beach. One year around 1968 there was a massive emergence of “double drummers’ (Thopha saccata) in the bush and a fierce northerly wind blew all day and blew them out to sea where thousands drowned. The following southerly change blew them back to shore and left a high tide line of cicadas about 20 per metre along the entire length of 7 mile beach!! That memory really sticks! Actually, I didn’t appreciate how many species of cicadas were in Australia until Max Moulds book came out in 1990- seems there’s 500+ species!
Comment by David E — June 15, 2009 [AT] 4:54 am
Reporting from Alto, New Mexico where my juniper and pinon are full of cicadas!! Carcasses all over my backyard. I’ve lived here three years- this is a first out here for me. I remember them growing up in Michigan.
Comment by M. Deward — May 31, 2009 [AT] 12:10 pm
Does anyone remember what it was like in the Sixties in Australia (East Coast), collecting and swapping cicadas, especially the “Black Prince”? Thank you. (c:
Comment by Sonja — April 29, 2009 [AT] 7:14 pm
Brood x 2004 is still affecting my trees. the “bug experts”
who come out of the woodwork for each cicada emergence will have to prove to me that splitting virtually every leaf bearing branch on a tree 5-20 inches will result in minimal damage to a mature tree
Comment by brian — April 22, 2009 [AT] 11:28 am
Mayme, try ebay or Craigs List. I see wings show up on ebay all the time.
Comment by Dan — April 20, 2009 [AT] 4:08 pm
Hi, I am looking for a source for cicada wings (only after they have lost their life) I am an artist and I need large quantities for a project I am working on and most specimens are too expensive. I have no problem with removing the wings myself.
Comment by Mayme Kratz — April 20, 2009 [AT] 12:14 pm
April 18, 2009 Hello, I live in Lansing Michigan. Those noisy critters are here in the park next to my house! Dang things woke me up from a peaceful sleep at 10:30 this evening. I wasn’t expecting them this year, what the heck is going on????????????
Comment by Lisa Morse — April 18, 2009 [AT] 8:04 pm
Kate — fantastic tattoo — as Flickr allows me too, I’m going to blog about it on the homepage as well.
Comment by Dan — April 11, 2009 [AT] 7:48 am
Hi All, I found this website looking for pictures of cicadas to get a tattoo. My grandfather and I used to search for them in the backyard at his old house and get so excited to find the “shells” on the old red maple tree. I got a fantastic tattoo of one but have no idea how to load it to share with you all. Can someone help me? Thanks!
Comment by Kate — April 11, 2009 [AT] 5:53 am
Thanks! then looks like i’ve to find them here in germany. Does anyone knows where i might be able to find cicada in germany and when are they out?
Comment by Denis — April 6, 2009 [AT] 11:31 pm
Hi Denis, Live cicadas are out around the Equatorial countires at present (SE Asia and Central America). Live cicadas won’t survive postage!!
Comment by David E — April 6, 2009 [AT] 8:07 pm
Heloo!
I was wondering if anyone in any part of the world has seen now in this time cicadas? I’m actually looking for alive cicada, which i would like to use for a project of mine before letting it go free.
Would anyone help me in finding on and send it to me in germany?
Best regards
Comment by Denis — April 6, 2009 [AT] 3:43 am
In response to the person who wants recipes: Try putting in a few terms at Amazon. Also, on this website there are some links with recipes, though I don’t know if there is anything before 1994. I was looking for this info to, and what’s here plus a few books on Amazon were all I found.
I’m working on a children’s novel(and I plan to make a curriculum to go along with it) that has a lot to do with cicadas. I need some information, if anyone can help me.
First, I want the setting to be where there are many different emergences, and I believe that this would be southern Illinois, but from my maps, can’t tell exactly. Are there any exact maps anywhere?
Second, at what time of year do cicadas emerge? I’ve heard early spring, but I’ve also hear in June. I suppose this has to do with how far north the emergence is taking place, but does anyone know this info exactly?
Third, If cicadas emerge in an area where there has been no spraying, are they safe to eat for animals? I would assume so, especially if they are caught and prepared before their exoskeletons harden. Have there been any reports from farmers about their livestock being adversly affected? (reports from those who farm organically would be especially interesting, as they wouldn’t have the ordinary pesticides.)
Thank you!
Comment by Jennifer Stasinopoulos — March 25, 2009 [AT] 8:07 am
Hellow, I am looking for cicada’s formal recipes. Does anybody knows any books published in U.S.A. before 1994 that has Cicada’s cooking recipe?
Comment by Kuo Liao — March 13, 2009 [AT] 5:19 pm
I just saw a really cute demonstration on a David Attenborough show about Life in the Undergrowth. Mr. A. showed that male periodical cicadas would respond to finger-snaps just as they would to the wing-clicks of a female. He led it about on a branch just by snapping his fingers. I wish I’d known this when the cicadas visited my park in 2004 — it would have been a cute trick to show the kids. You ought to put this on your website — it would fascinate kids — and that’s the first step in getting them interested in something! It’s a shame I’ll have to wait till 2021 to try this — (actually, I could travel to the next emergence area and try it, of course.)
Sarah Dalton
Senior Naturalist
Blendon Woods Metro Park
Comment by Sarah Dalton — March 12, 2009 [AT] 7:33 pm
Hello, I am from Singapore in South East Asia. We don’t have much cicadas in Singapore but I was in Brunei once and saw many cicadas for the first time. One day a local showed me a rare cicada that he caught. It had a distinct beautiful coloration. I believe it had a dark “metallic” blue body with a yellow band under its head with I believe red coloured wings. The local told me it was a “queen” cicada. I’ve tried to search for pictures of this and the only one I could find is on this website which has expired. But google still kept the picture. The link is
http://images.google.com.sg/imgres?imgurl=http://www.cicado.com/Cicada.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.cicado.com/old-cicado.html&usg=__BUTPWa-_R-9IX2hWiR-1QKKh7KY=&h=575&w=380&sz=85&hl=en&start=4&um=1&tbnid=-F-8G-_JBq2sIM:&tbnh=134&tbnw=89&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dsite:www.cicado.com%2Bcicada%26ndsp%3D18%26hl%3Den%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-US:official%26um%3D1
Sorry it’s so long, but that’s the only one I could find. Could anybody tell me is this really a “queen” cicada? Or is it a subspecies? Thank you very much!
2009 General Cicada Questions
These questions come from the old General Cicada Questions message board. The questions and answers are in reverse order. URLs found in comments are old and likely do not work.
Hi Jay- the bottle exuviae are similar to the “floury Baker” (Aleeta curvicosta) and I shall try to post a picture. Max Mould’s book “Australian cicadas” has a picture. My daughter was at Hawk’s Nest last week and caught a few smaller species. One was black and about 12mm long (with wings)and has a different song to similar species around sydney here.
To Vhem,
Around 18C is about the temp for green grocers (GGs) to sing at night. I have noticed recently that our local bottle cicadas will sing on evenings that are around 16C. If the temp is hot, GGs will sing around every 4 hours during the night. Those bugs ain’t so small- I guess it depends what species are out in numbers around your place!
David
Comment by David Emery — December 17, 2009 [AT] 10:17 pm
Hi there
We live on the Central Coast of NSW and the cicada’s are out and going for it. Have noticed that alot of people mention how loud they are but maybe we are just use to it. My daughter spends her time searching for the spent cicada shells and now has quite a collection. While looking at these shells and listening to their song, my children and myself were discussing the why’s and how’s of cicada and my eldest mentioned that the cicada will only start to sing once the temperature has reached a certain degree, I agreed with him that I had once heard this too. We’ve tried some internet searching and have come up with no ansewer to our question.
So we now ask you budding cicada enthusiasts is this fact or myth. If it is fact what is the temperature that makes these cute little bugs sing for us all day.
ps: your site is great — we learnt alot about cicadas from your site.
cheers — vhem
(veronica, hayden, ethan, madison)
Comment by veronica — December 17, 2009 [AT] 5:34 pm
thanx David — I should have known there’ld be more than one “midget”. They are black, about one third your little finger in length. U probably know them well but if I can grab a pic, I will. Why is it I’ve not seen a Bottle casting? Would I know the diffrence if I saw one? Jay
Comment by Jay — December 16, 2009 [AT] 8:35 pm
Hi Jay,
Sydney bottles are isolated populations and there are certainly more on the central coast down to Avoca beach. What do you mean by “midget” as there are around 10 species from central coast? Would be useful to post a photo. The Blue mountains are heaving with the medium and smaller species as well at the moment, probably reflecting recent fires and recurrent showers.
David.
Comment by David E — December 9, 2009 [AT] 4:01 pm
g’day Cicada maniacs — how is it I didn’t even know about Bottle Cicadas, let alone see them, in all my years in Sydney. discovered them on the Central Coast, just 50ks north. And why are there some with both sets of wings and others with inner set only? The ones in my area have both.
It’s cicada Heaven here at the moment for green, black, midget and bottle. thanx, Jay
Comment by Jay — December 8, 2009 [AT] 2:12 am
Elias,
I can get you some exuviae here if you like. Contact Dan for my email.
David.
Comment by David E — November 27, 2009 [AT] 8:33 pm
Chris,
Definitely a Pauropsalta mneme- called the “alarm clock ticker” because of the shrill buzz. It has a huge range in NSW. They are emerging around Canberra now, along with about 6-8 other species.
David.
Comment by David E — November 27, 2009 [AT] 8:32 pm
Chris,
That looks like a Pauropsalta mneme.
Comment by Dan — November 24, 2009 [AT] 7:37 pm
Hi,
I managed to photograph a cicada at a site in the central tablelands on NSW Australia.last week, rather small about 35mm long. An image can be found at this link:
http://homepages.ihug.com.au/~chrisx2/images/BP_Cicada.jpg
Hoping I can get an ID, seems to be hard to find references to cicadas on the net.
regards,
Chris Ross
Comment by Chris Ross — November 24, 2009 [AT] 6:24 pm
I am also very interested in exuvia (nymph shells). I was lucky to collect about 26 exuvia of Tibicen auletes, North America’s largest cicada. I have a specimen of Pomponia imperatoria as an adult. Really would like to get a nymphal exuvia. I checked the links Dan provided and couldn’t find any. Does anyone know where to find one?
Comment by Elias — November 21, 2009 [AT] 3:11 pm
In Center City Philadelphia, cicada singing is common in August. What species might this be?
Comment by Kenneth Frank — November 15, 2009 [AT] 7:06 pm
Can Cicadas loose a leg and survive?
I accidently hurt a cicada that I found when shaking the washing.
It is resting in a tree in shock as it had lost one leg from the knee, though has all other legs.
Hasn’t moved much all day, though walked up branch about 20 centremetres.
I havent ever seen one here and was not expecting to find one on washing. Will have to check dry clothes from now on.
xx ab
Comment by Alicia Bee — November 15, 2009 [AT] 4:13 am
Hi Dave J,
Will see what I can do- there are quite a few GGs out now and we caught 2 Thopha (DDs) emerging yesterday around Kempsey on the north coast- first of the season so far.You had best contact Dan for my email and then I can get your postal address.
cheers,
David.
Comment by David E — November 9, 2009 [AT] 3:02 am
Hello David Emery in Sydney I assume. Could you send me some green grocer & or Double drummer shells. I need about 20 or so….will be glad to pay shipping. Was in Sydney once, Farmer’s Cove, burned the crap out of my thigh collecting some sort of palm seeds (red furry little rascals) that I had put in my pocket!
Cheers, Dave
Comment by Dave J — November 5, 2009 [AT] 2:27 pm
To Dave J- depends where in the world you are. Most of the shells in the tropics will be degraded by now. In Sydney, we have some green grocer shells (2 weeks old) that are around 5cm long. If you wait a month you can secure some Double drummer shells that are larger!!
Comment by David Emery — November 2, 2009 [AT] 9:50 pm
Cicadas of the genus Pomponia are the largest.
Comment by Dan — November 2, 2009 [AT] 8:31 pm
I need the largest cicada shells available for an art project. Where can I get them?
Comment by Dave J — November 2, 2009 [AT] 10:21 am
Hi Elias,
Most emerge in the early evening to make the most of the bird-free zone. Some unfortunates (including me) run into some rather carnivorous tree crickets, huntsman (tarantula) spiders and nocturnal ants at night, but most emergences are uncomplicated. some cicadas get their times awry and maybe left coming out at sunrise.
We have several species that also emerge before dawn (Frogattoides pallida and F.typica in the desert) and if emergences are large, some like Thopha saccata (double drummer), Psaltoda plaga and Ps moerens (black prince and red-eye, respectively) and even small Urabunana verna, will emerge during the day- like your Magis! They’re all in Max’s book.
We have just had a week of wet weather with 75mm rain, so now things are heating up. I have noted 12 species out so far around Sydney.
Comment by David E — October 30, 2009 [AT] 5:04 pm
Hello David,
Do you notice any different times for nymphs to come above ground? Do some species prefer times other than 8-10PM?
Thanks for your replies.
Elias
Comment by Elias — October 25, 2009 [AT] 6:38 pm
I know that problem! One solution I found is I have small containers with completely flat surfaces and nothing to climb on. I place one newly captured, non eclosing nymph into each container. As long as the nymph remains in the prone position, they usually do not eclose (I have seen some exceptions, especially with T. cannicularis for some reason). Got this tip from Gerry Bunker and it works most of the time. Maybe the Green Grocers act differently? I love Australian Cicadas. I have been through Max Mould’s book many times. Please keep us posted!!
Comment by Elias — October 24, 2009 [AT] 7:05 am
Yeah Elias,
If you take them off the trees when emerging and don’t hook them (shells or exuviae) into a curtain or the inside of the “boot” (“trunk” to you in the USA) of the car, you will get loads of deformities as the larger ones can’t emerge correctly on their sides or backs. Nylon shirts are great to sink the claws into, but in the field, the boot of the car is great for transportation!!
Cheers,
David.
Comment by David E — October 21, 2009 [AT] 3:13 am
Awesome pictures, David. You found many Green Grocer nymphs that eclosed. Seems like many specimens were deformed by hemolymph. The cicadas of Australia are nice and big for the most part. We live vicariously through you. I wonder if its possible to post some videos of them calling. Hopefully this will be a fruitful summer for you. Here in NY, it’s is cold and rainy and the cicadas have been dead for over a month. Can’t complain however, I did manage to capture my first Tibicen auletes.
Comment by Elias — October 18, 2009 [AT] 6:28 am
Here’s some Green Grocers. Kevin’s photos.
Comment by Dan — October 13, 2009 [AT] 6:59 pm
Hi Dan,
As you northerners rue the passing of summer and dream about next season, I will just let you know that the Green Grocer cicadas (Cyclochila australasiae) have commenced emerging in the mountains west of Sydney. The Sydney city emergence should start in a couple of weeks.
David.
Comment by David Emery — October 13, 2009 [AT] 6:34 pm
Quesada gigas song:
Cicada metamorfosis:
Text PDF about brazilian cicadas, with photos:
http://www.acervodigital.ufrrj.br/insetos/insetos_do_brasil/conteudo/tomo_03/02_cicadoida.pdf
Comment by wenilton luis daltro — October 9, 2009 [AT] 6:52 am
Do cicadas normally live in WESTERN Oregon? We heard one there this summer, and while I grew up in W. Oregon, I don’t believe they normally occur there, and had never heard of it before. I’ve been trying to figure it out from the internet stuff, but all I could find was that they DO occur in EASTERN Oregon, which is a much dryer climate (sage brush & juniper as opposed to ferns, moss, and big trees in the W.) I was just curious, because we’ve also seen praying mantis in western OR and WA in the last few years, and they were never native here, either. Please e-mail me at ciscoshirlbw [AT] yahoo.com
Thanks
Comment by Shirley — October 3, 2009 [AT] 3:00 pm
Wow, it is not even Spring yet for Australia and cicadas are out already! Hope this is a great season for you David. Bladder cicadas have a very interesting morphology.
Comment by Elias — September 18, 2009 [AT] 4:08 am
Bladder cicadas (Cystostoma saundersi) are out in Sydney Australia. The Aussie cicada season is open for business!
Comment by David Emery — September 16, 2009 [AT] 4:18 pm
It’s September 15 in Frederick Maryland and the cicadas have stopped singing 🙁 Last night they were talking up storm. They had so much to say. Today it is so quiet. It’s sad. Every year, one day in the middle of September, they just stop. Fall is coming. I do love Fall, but I will miss the cicadas’ song until next July.
Comment by Alison — September 15, 2009 [AT] 7:52 am
I would assume they were house fly or blue/green bottle fly larva. Cicada killers seal the cicadas in a cell and lay an egg on them. It is not possible to come upon a cicada kiler larva by chance alone above ground.
Comment by Elias — September 9, 2009 [AT] 3:29 am
We found a dead cicada on our porch. My daughter was checking it out when a maggot started coming out of it. We put the cicada in a plastic cup and 3 more maggots eventually came out of the cicada. I read some about the cicada killer wasps but this doesn’t seem like a cicada killer. Does anyone know what the maggots could be?
Comment by Valerie — September 8, 2009 [AT] 7:59 pm
Hi Jennifer: Elias is correct that the “blood” is cicada blood or haemolymph. We have moved hundreds of emerging cicadas from local tress onto our house curtains so my kids could watch and photograph emergence. During eclosion or emergence, cicadas pump this around to initially “force’ open the shell, probably with the help of a few proteases (that means the shells are “medicinal” and anti-febrile for traditional medicine!!) and pump the head and thorax through the split followed by legs. Then they hang to harden the legs before extracting the rest of the body (abdomen) and ahnging from the shell (exuviae)- fantastic to watch!! They then pump haemolymph into the patent wing veins to expand the wings- these veins collapse when the wings harden and dry in the breeze and sun. If there is a lesion or malfunction causing “bleeding”, there is usually a casuality in the emergence or in wing expansion, making them as easy target for predators.
Comment by David Emery — September 1, 2009 [AT] 7:21 pm
Rachelle, I, too, live in NY. We have cicadas here and no need to report them! If you wish to send me the specimen I can identify it for you. i live in Queens County.
Jennifer, I have seen this phenomenon too. When there is less undergrowth, cicadas compete for sites to eclose. They can injury each other with their sharp forelegs or be injured by ants and spiders looking to feed on them. Also during the eclose process injuries can occur. The bluish jelly like material is “hemolymph”i.e. cicada blood ,and turns black when exposed to the air. When they “bleed” alot, they usually fail to eclose. I hope this helps.
Comment by Elias — September 1, 2009 [AT] 2:59 pm
thanks Dan — presumably therefore, it only takes one to start and within a second, they’re all at it. How it is that they all end at the same time remains a mystery. I’ll be listening more intently this summer.
Comment by Jay — September 1, 2009 [AT] 3:41 am
I’ve been “helping” our regular, 2 year cicadas for years when they come out of the ground and I’ve seen all kinds of conditions and problems. One problem really “bugs” me (pun intended). I come across a few each year that seem to have some sort of bleeding disorder. They rarely make it off the ground. The “blood” pools behind the shell and I can see the black through the shell and even seeping out through the shell. They have no sign of injury. They just keep bleeding from all over. Every now and then I will find one that has “eclosed” (borrowing a term from butterflies), but the adult ends up bleeding all over the tree and doesn’t survive. Has anyone else seen this and has anyone come across any research that describes something like this, assuming there is research about the physical workings of cicadas?
Comment by Jennifer — August 30, 2009 [AT] 8:19 pm
Help!
It’s 8.31.09, I’m in Brooklyn, NY and found one just like the blue/green one Dan has posted. I dont know how this poor thing came in, the screens are closed, he’s so big he scared the cats flittering and skittering himself all around and landed in a water filled soup pot that was soaking in sink. He’s deceased, but should I let anyone ‘official’ know? I never saw anything like this…in NY
Comment by Rachelle — August 30, 2009 [AT] 7:31 pm
Hello Jeff. The species of cicada is called Tibicen pruinosa. Here is a link to show what it looks like: http://www.musicofnature.com/songsofinsects/iframes/cicadas/popup_tibiprui.html
You are in a flat area that gets lots of sun and cicada killers will frequently make large mounds of dirt. See if you see the large female wasp entering and leaving the burrow. Sometimes she will bring paralyzed cicadas right in. This is the most comprehensive site on cicada killers I know of: http://ww2.lafayette.edu/~hollidac/cicadakillerhome.html
Other wasps also make burrows, but cicada killers make the largest.
Nice video — tell us what you find!
Comment by Elias — August 30, 2009 [AT] 5:47 am
are these cicada mounds I dont know
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gbHL-POMTc0
Comment by jeff edwards — August 29, 2009 [AT] 8:24 pm
Jay,
All the males (the ones that sing) are competing for mates, so if one starts to sing the others don’t want to be left out, so they all start to sing.
Comment by Dan — August 28, 2009 [AT] 5:21 am
g’day fellow cicada people. I know sfa about cicadas — I just love em. Here’s a stupid question — how is it that dozens or hundreds begin and end their ‘singing’ at the same time?
let me know if the answer is already here somewhere. thanx, Jay
Comment by Jay — August 28, 2009 [AT] 4:50 am
Wow — this is still technically winter for Australia. That is awesome. Here in NY we have to wait at least 3 months after the end of winter. Hope this is a good season for “down under”.
Comment by Elias — August 21, 2009 [AT] 3:25 pm
Hi All,
After quite a warm winter, I am pleased to report the first song of a Cicadetta celis (“silver princess”) in the melaleucas around Sydney- roll on the southern hemisphere cicada season.
David.
Comment by David Emery — August 20, 2009 [AT] 9:51 pm
Does anyone in New York, New Jersey or Connecticut have any experience with hearing or finding Tibicen auletes? Here is a picture and call of this species for reference: http://www.musicofnature.com/songsofinsects/iframes/cicadas/popup_tibiaule.html
Comment by Elias — August 19, 2009 [AT] 5:27 pm
The observation of the loudness of cicadas with regard to temeprature has been studied. “Body Temeprature and the Acoustic Behavior of the Cicada Tibicen Winemanna” by Allen Sanboern published in the Journal of Insect Behavior
Comment by Elias — July 21, 2009 [AT] 10:14 am
Why do cicadas sound louder when its hot?
Comment by raevans — July 15, 2009 [AT] 11:45 am
to CeeCee,
Cicada songsa mean “summer” down under!
Comment by David E — July 11, 2009 [AT] 4:16 am
old wives tale says noise of cicadas signify something. Fogs, rain etc. what is it?
Comment by CeeCee — July 8, 2009 [AT] 9:27 am
Hello Dan,
Heard back from Max Moulds who was kind enough to reply to my email. The good news is a second edition of Australain Cicadas will be produced which will have a considerably expanded introductory chapter and an additional 100 species.
The bad news is we will have to wait at least 5 years!!
So here is our answer. Like anything with cicadas, we need patience. At least it’s not 17 years!!
Comment by Elias — July 5, 2009 [AT] 5:54 am
Hi Dan,
Max Moulds now lives in Kurandah near Cairns- he will be publishing a monograph on revised taxonomy of Australian Cicadettini soon, but don’t expect another edition of the book in the near future.
to Saeed; join the Yahoo Entomology-Cicadidae chat group and ask Fariba- she is a cicadaphile from Iran and works at the museum on plant pathogens
Comment by David E — July 5, 2009 [AT] 4:54 am
I am a Ph.D Student of Agricultural Entomology in University of Tehran, IRAN. I have caught some cicadas and cooked them by use of water-salt solution. Its taste is good, but i like to learn more recipes. Is there any person to help me?
Comment by Saeed Heidari — July 4, 2009 [AT] 8:53 am
Hello Dan,
The given email stated Dr. Moulds is no longer at that address. It then gives you another address to write too. I have asked our question and will patiently await a reply. I will keep you posted.
Take care,
Elias
Comment by Elias — July 2, 2009 [AT] 7:04 pm
Elias,
Let me know what you find out about the book.
Dan
Comment by Dan — June 30, 2009 [AT] 9:07 pm
Hello Dan,
Thank you very much! i have sent an email to Dr Moulds and I will keep you apprised as to its outcome.
Just got back from Las Vegas where I caught two Diceroprocta specimens just a block from the Las Vegas strip! They are currently alive in my little butterfly pavillion. I will see if they can call today.
Have a good day,
Elias
Comment by Elias — June 30, 2009 [AT] 8:01 am
Elias, have your tried contacting Max?
http://australianmuseum.net.au/staff/max-moulds/
Comment by Dan — June 24, 2009 [AT] 9:08 pm
Does anyone know if Max Moulds will write an updated edition? I have that book and it is excellent.
Comment by Elias — June 23, 2009 [AT] 3:09 pm
Hi Denis (April 6)- I think that Germany may be too far north for many cicadas. Try south of the Alps.
To Sonja (April 29)- Yeah, I live on the south coast in Oz and remember the seasons: especially the sand fairies (Cicadetta arenaria)landing on your towel at the beach. One year around 1968 there was a massive emergence of “double drummers’ (Thopha saccata) in the bush and a fierce northerly wind blew all day and blew them out to sea where thousands drowned. The following southerly change blew them back to shore and left a high tide line of cicadas about 20 per metre along the entire length of 7 mile beach!! That memory really sticks! Actually, I didn’t appreciate how many species of cicadas were in Australia until Max Moulds book came out in 1990- seems there’s 500+ species!
Comment by David E — June 15, 2009 [AT] 4:54 am
Reporting from Alto, New Mexico where my juniper and pinon are full of cicadas!! Carcasses all over my backyard. I’ve lived here three years- this is a first out here for me. I remember them growing up in Michigan.
Comment by M. Deward — May 31, 2009 [AT] 12:10 pm
Does anyone remember what it was like in the Sixties in Australia (East Coast), collecting and swapping cicadas, especially the “Black Prince”? Thank you. (c:
Comment by Sonja — April 29, 2009 [AT] 7:14 pm
Brood x 2004 is still affecting my trees. the “bug experts”
who come out of the woodwork for each cicada emergence will have to prove to me that splitting virtually every leaf bearing branch on a tree 5-20 inches will result in minimal damage to a mature tree
Comment by brian — April 22, 2009 [AT] 11:28 am
Mayme, try ebay or Craigs List. I see wings show up on ebay all the time.
Comment by Dan — April 20, 2009 [AT] 4:08 pm
Hi, I am looking for a source for cicada wings (only after they have lost their life) I am an artist and I need large quantities for a project I am working on and most specimens are too expensive. I have no problem with removing the wings myself.
Comment by Mayme Kratz — April 20, 2009 [AT] 12:14 pm
April 18, 2009
Hello, I live in Lansing Michigan. Those noisy critters are here in the park next to my house! Dang things woke me up from a peaceful sleep at 10:30 this evening. I wasn’t expecting them this year, what the heck is going on????????????
Comment by Lisa Morse — April 18, 2009 [AT] 8:04 pm
Kate — fantastic tattoo — as Flickr allows me too, I’m going to blog about it on the homepage as well.
Comment by Dan — April 11, 2009 [AT] 7:48 am
Hi All, I found this website looking for pictures of cicadas to get a tattoo. My grandfather and I used to search for them in the backyard at his old house and get so excited to find the “shells” on the old red maple tree. I got a fantastic tattoo of one but have no idea how to load it to share with you all. Can someone help me? Thanks!
Comment by Kate — April 11, 2009 [AT] 5:53 am
Thanks! then looks like i’ve to find them here in germany. Does anyone knows where i might be able to find cicada in germany and when are they out?
Comment by Denis — April 6, 2009 [AT] 11:31 pm
Hi Denis,
Live cicadas are out around the Equatorial countires at present (SE Asia and Central America). Live cicadas won’t survive postage!!
Comment by David E — April 6, 2009 [AT] 8:07 pm
Heloo!
I was wondering if anyone in any part of the world has seen now in this time cicadas? I’m actually looking for alive cicada, which i would like to use for a project of mine before letting it go free.
Would anyone help me in finding on and send it to me in germany?
Best regards
Comment by Denis — April 6, 2009 [AT] 3:43 am
In response to the person who wants recipes: Try putting in a few terms at Amazon. Also, on this website there are some links with recipes, though I don’t know if there is anything before 1994. I was looking for this info to, and what’s here plus a few books on Amazon were all I found.
I’m working on a children’s novel(and I plan to make a curriculum to go along with it) that has a lot to do with cicadas. I need some information, if anyone can help me.
First, I want the setting to be where there are many different emergences, and I believe that this would be southern Illinois, but from my maps, can’t tell exactly. Are there any exact maps anywhere?
Second, at what time of year do cicadas emerge? I’ve heard early spring, but I’ve also hear in June. I suppose this has to do with how far north the emergence is taking place, but does anyone know this info exactly?
Third, If cicadas emerge in an area where there has been no spraying, are they safe to eat for animals? I would assume so, especially if they are caught and prepared before their exoskeletons harden. Have there been any reports from farmers about their livestock being adversly affected? (reports from those who farm organically would be especially interesting, as they wouldn’t have the ordinary pesticides.)
Thank you!
Comment by Jennifer Stasinopoulos — March 25, 2009 [AT] 8:07 am
Hellow, I am looking for cicada’s formal recipes. Does anybody knows any books published in U.S.A. before 1994 that has Cicada’s cooking recipe?
Comment by Kuo Liao — March 13, 2009 [AT] 5:19 pm
I just saw a really cute demonstration on a David Attenborough show about Life in the Undergrowth. Mr. A. showed that male periodical cicadas would respond to finger-snaps just as they would to the wing-clicks of a female. He led it about on a branch just by snapping his fingers. I wish I’d known this when the cicadas visited my park in 2004 — it would have been a cute trick to show the kids. You ought to put this on your website — it would fascinate kids — and that’s the first step in getting them interested in something! It’s a shame I’ll have to wait till 2021 to try this — (actually, I could travel to the next emergence area and try it, of course.)
Sarah Dalton
Senior Naturalist
Blendon Woods Metro Park
Comment by Sarah Dalton — March 12, 2009 [AT] 7:33 pm
Hello, I am from Singapore in South East Asia. We don’t have much cicadas in Singapore but I was in Brunei once and saw many cicadas for the first time. One day a local showed me a rare cicada that he caught. It had a distinct beautiful coloration. I believe it had a dark “metallic” blue body with a yellow band under its head with I believe red coloured wings. The local told me it was a “queen” cicada. I’ve tried to search for pictures of this and the only one I could find is on this website which has expired. But google still kept the picture. The link is
http://images.google.com.sg/imgres?imgurl=http://www.cicado.com/Cicada.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.cicado.com/old-cicado.html&usg=__BUTPWa-_R-9IX2hWiR-1QKKh7KY=&h=575&w=380&sz=85&hl=en&start=4&um=1&tbnid=-F-8G-_JBq2sIM:&tbnh=134&tbnw=89&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dsite:www.cicado.com%2Bcicada%26ndsp%3D18%26hl%3Den%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-US:official%26um%3D1
Sorry it’s so long, but that’s the only one I could find. Could anybody tell me is this really a “queen” cicada? Or is it a subspecies? Thank you very much!
Comment by Jem — March 12, 2009 [AT] 7:30 pm